Episode 55

Show Notes:

Live with Matt Rad - Episode 55
May 25, 2021
w/ Jon Castelli - Week 49

Show notes by: Bradley Will

The reality of the business is that everyone takes forever to pay.

• Even at the level of Jon and Matt people still don’t want to pay you.
  

For Jon the problem is the contracts and agreements not being finished before song is mixed.

Jon:
Sometimes I’ll mix two albums in a month, but will not get paid until 3 months later.

It’s important to have some savings/investments in the bank in order to keep you sane while you are waiting for the payments to come through.


Cian Riordan says in the live comments:
“I have two jobs. One is trying to get paid for the other.”


Matt:
To be both a creative and an entrepreneur presents some very unique challenges that are completely different from most other jobs.


Jon:
There was one song that I worked on and it took three years before the contract was finally executed and I got royalties on it. Royalties that would have made a big difference in my life if I had received them on time.

This is the reason I still do a fair amount of independent work: There are less contractual issues to sort through and I can get paid more quickly.


Matt:
This is why it is so important for people to represent you. You need someone to help you figure out the changing ways in which the business is handled.


Jon:
You can’t put all of your eggs in one basket: Sitting on one album for too long without any guarantee that it will be released. Be diversified in your projects.

If you’re an engineer, get a contract, or at least a salary while working on an album with no guarantee of release. Be negotiable if you believe in the artist, but you should not be ashamed of having your costs covered by the artist you’re supporting and working for.

To get paid on the front-end you need to sign a mixer/producer declaration. It is a simple agreement that takes leverage away from your negotiation later on.

• Jon’s lawyer advises him not to sign these because it gives her more headroom to negotiate in a way that will benefit him far better later on.

• It’s not the thing to do, unless you’re really hungry and need the money immediately.
  

Matt:
I won’t start work on a song until the agreement is written and signed.

In the long run, your integrity with yourself and your own self-worth/belief is much more powerful than people give it credit for.

• No matter what you do, you’re there because these people hiring you can’t do it without you.

• It’s important to stand up for that stuff.
  

If you’re going to do some long-term projects make sure you’re doing some short-term projects in case the large project falls through.


Jon:
You have a full rate to occupy your time. You shouldn’t be expected to lower your rate if you’re busy taking jobs from other people who are willing to pay your own rate.

If you can’t afford my rate then communicate with me. I have a lot of mixer friends who can do it for less who I’d be happy to pass it on to.

I’ve almost given up on getting credited properly. Every time I look for my name on the records I am disappointed to find myself not credited.

My corner of the industry is still dominated by the same few mixers. Occasionally we’ll be able to squeak in a few releases that they would have done. If I take it slow and keep an upward trajectory I know that in 5-10 years from now I will get a chance to be in their place as the old-mixers phase out.

I’m not in the game of chasing the hit.

Why are we trying to put ourselves next to the old-guard A-list mixers and trying to compete with them numerically instead of putting ourselves in our own creative lanes?


Matt:
Those getting the most mixes at the highest level are those who were in our position 10-15 years ago.

A lot of people are relentless about trying to get a hit

I don’t know anyone who is motivated by chasing things that are happy.


Jon:
I mix a lot of songs that are clearly chasing the song of the month/week. Sometimes they’re even in the same key as the song that they’re chasing.


Matt:
Most of the money that gets made or gets spent in the music industry is chasing the thing that was a hit.

• The majority of the songs I’m receiving usually have at least one reference to a hit that is big at the moment.

• There’s a lot of motivation to chase things.

• There are a lot of business mechanisms that are there facilitate that.
  

“Trend is always late.”
- Kanye West


Jon:
I can’t project my finances for the year. Some people can because of the type of jobs that they have. It’s not a luxury that people in the music industry can have.


Matt:
A lot of people will tell you that they’re very sure about what will be successful. But as someone in a creative/entrepreneurial industry you’ve really got to temper your expectations and make sure you’re thinking about long-term things. Because short term stuff is always going to be talked about rarely plays out. When it does that’s a great bonus.

“Once you make things and put them out in the world they are no longer yours.”

Q: Money Projects vs. Passion Projects?

Jon:
They’re all money projects and they’re all passion projects

• Meaning money fuels the capability to be passionate about the project

• Other times the passion fuels the ability to make money.
  

I get paid to be passionate about things.

I have to ask myself will I bring value to this record?

I don’t see money and passion as being on opposite sides of the spectrum.


Matt:
The Neil Gaiman commencement speech:

• Think of your career as walking towards a distant mountain that you may never reach. Ask yourself; will a gig take you closer towards the mountain or farther from it?
  

The majority of creative endeavors that happen in the world are probably not paid.

That’s the luxury of success. You can get paid to be creative.